On Friday, November 3, KUED broadcast
a live, audience-driven debate between Republican incumbent
Orrin Hatch and Democrat Pete Ashdown. KUED Senior Producer
Ken Verdoia moderated.
Following is a full transcript:
KEN VERDOIA: GOOD EVENING.
I'M KEN VERDOIA, AND WELCOME
TO THE STUDIOS AT KUED.
YOU'VE PROBABLY TUNED IN FOR A
DEBATE BETWEEN CANDIDATES FOR
THE UNITED STATES SENATE
BEFORE.
NORMALLY THAT WOULD MEAN
PEOPLE WOULD BE IN THESE
SEATS.
CLEARLY THAT IS NOT THE CASE
TONIGHT.
THE CAMPAIGN STAFF OF ORRIN
HATCH DECLINED OUR INVITATION
TO ENGAGE IN A DEBATE.
IT'S THE FIRST TIME A CAMPAIGN
HAS DECLINED AN INVITATION.
SO WE FOUND OURSELVES IN
UNFAMILIAR TERRITORY.
BUT THE SALT LAKE ROTARY CLUB
GRACIOUSLY ALLOWED US TO TAPE
AN EXCHANGE BETWEEN ORRIN
HATCH AND HIS DEMOCRATIC
CHALLENGER, PETER ASHDOWN.
IT HAPPENED AT THE MARRIOTT
HOTEL.
AND THE MODERATOR IS BOB
SPRINGMEYER.
BOB SPRINGMEYER :
ARE WE READY TO HAVE SOME
FUN?
WE FLIPPED A COIN, SO PETE
ASHDOWN WILL BE THE FIRST TO
SPEAK AND FOLLOWED BY
INTRODUCTORY REMARKS BY
SENATOR ORRIN HATCH.
PETE ASHDOWN GREW UP IN UTAH
AND GRADUATED AT WOODS CROSS,
AND STARTED AT THE UNIVERSITY
OF UTAH IN FILM MAKING, AND
TRANSFERRED OVER TO COMPUTER
SCIENCE.
WORKED FOR A PERIOD AT EVANS
AND SUTHERLAND.
IN 1990, AFTER -- 1993, EXCUSE
ME, UPON THE URGING OF HIS
FATHER, STARTED HIS OWN
BUSINESS, X-MISSION, AT THE
AGE OF 26.
HE WILL BE FOLLOWED THEN BY
SENATOR ORRIN HATCH, ELECTED
SENATOR IN 1976 AND STARTED
SERVING IN 1977.
HE'S CURRENTLY RANGING ON
SENATE COMMITTEE ON FINANCE
WHERE HE SERVES ON
INTERNATIONAL TRADE, HEALTH
CARE, AND ALSO ON THE
COMMITTEE ON INTELLIGENCE, AND
FORMER CHAIR OF THE JUDICIARY
COMMITTEE, NOW RANKING.
AS HE COMPLETES THIS TERM HE
WILL TIE THE LONGEST SERVING
SENATOR FROM THE STATE OF
UTAH.
AND THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN REED
SMOOT WHO SERVED FROM 1903 TO
1933.
SO WITH THAT WE'LL GO TO PETER
ASHDOWN, TO BE FOLLOWED BY
REMARKS FROM SENATOR HATCH
PETE ASHDOWN: THANK YOU, IT'S
GOOD TO BE HOME.
I WANT TO EXTEND MY THANKS TO
THE ROTARY.
WHEN I STARTED ROTARY IN 2004
MY BUSINESS WAS COMMITTED TO
THE COMMUNITY.
BUT ROTARY TAUGHT ME THAT I
NEEDED TO BE COMMITTED TO IT
MORE.
AND AS I LEARNED FROM PEOPLE
WHO CAME TO SPEAK TO US, I
LEARNED THAT WE HAVE A
DANGEROUS THING COMING IN OUR
CHILD'S HEALTH WITH DIABETES
AND OBESITY.
I LEARNED YOU CAN CURE
BLINDNESS, SOME FORMS, FOR $20
A POP.
I LEARNED WE CAN BRING CLEAN
WATER TO VILLAGES FOR $2500.
AND I LEARNED THAT ALL WE NEED
TO DO TO PROTECT CHILDREN IN
SOME COUNTRIES IS BUY THEM A
5-DOLLAR MOSQUITO NET.
I'VE HAD THE OPPORTUNITY, THE
GIFT, TO GO THROUGHOUT UTAH
AND VISIT ROTARY CLUBS.
I VISITED OVER 30 ROTARY CLUBS
IN THE PAST YEAR AND A HALF.
AND GENE, YOU KNOW AS WELL AS
I DO, THERE'S NO BETTER PEOPLE
THAN ROTARIANS BECAUSE THEY
WANT TO DO MORE.
AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, BECAUSE
THEY'RE COMMITTED TO PEACE.
WE SHOULD ALL BE THINKING
ABOUT PEACE, AND NOT THINKING
ABOUT IT BEGRUDGINGLY, AND
HAVE IT AS A PRIMARY POINT IN
OUR LIVES, PEACE AND LOVE FOR
ONE ANOTHER.
AND I HAVE ROTARY TO THANK FOR
HAVING THAT IN MY LIFE.
AND I LOOK FORWARD TODAY TO
SPEAKING TO YOU ABOUT SOME OF
MY CAMPAIGN.
THANK YOU.
ORRIN HATCH: I'M HAPPY TO ONCE AGAIN BE
IN FRONT OF THE ROTARY CLUB.
I REMEMBER BACK IN 1976 I
DEBATED SENATOR MOSS IN FRONT
OF THE ROTARY CLUB.
IT WAS QUITE AN EXPERIENCE.
AND I CAN STILL SEE SOME OF
THOSE FACES.
IT'S A PRIVILEGE TO SERVE THE
STATE OF UTAH.
AND I WANT TO PAY TRIBUTE TO
MR. ASHDOWN.
HE'S BEEN A GENTLEMEN
THROUGHOUT THIS WHOLE MATTER,
AND I HAVE A LOT OF RESPECT
FOR HIM AND WHAT HE'S BEEN
ABLE TO ACCOMPLISH WITH HIS
BUSINESS.
THE REASON I'M RUNNING AGAIN
IS, I BELIEVE I CAN DO AN
AWFUL LOT OF GOOD FOR OUR
STATE.
WE HAVE A GREAT HERITAGE.
I THINK WE'RE IN A POSITION TO
DO A LOT FOR THE STATE AND I
THINK WE HAVE.
IT'S A BLESSING FOR ME TO BE
ABLE TO SERVE, AND I REALLY
HAVE APPRECIATED ALL OF YOU
OVER THESE YEARS.
WE'VE WORKED VERY HARD TO MAKE
SURE HILL AIR FORCE BASE IS
SOLID.
THAT'S 23,000 JOBS DIRECT OR
INDIRECTLY.
THE SKULL VALLEY DEPOSITORY,
THEY WERE GOING TO TRY AND
SHOVE THAT RIGHT UP OUR NOSES.
I'M GLAD I SAID THAT.
THANKFULLY I WAS ABLE TO PULL
MOST OF THE COMPANIES OFF OF
THE REPOSITORY COMPANY.
WE WROTE A LETTER, AND I STUCK
WITH THE ADMINISTRATION, AND
THE PRESIDENT WROTE A LETTER
CONCERNED ABOUT THE DESERT
TRAINING RANGE.
AND THEN I GOT THE SECRETARY
OF INTERIOR TO WRITE A LETTER
AND SAY THEY WERE CONCERNED.
AND THEN I GOT THE BLM TO OPEN
UP THE COMMENT PERIOD.
AND I WANT TO THANK YOU AND
THOUSANDS OF UTAHNS WHO WROTE
LETTERS AND HELPED TO DEFEAT
SKULL VALLEY.
AND I THINK IT SAVES OUR STATE
AN AWFUL LOT OF GRIEF.
MY TIME IS UP.
I JUST WANT TO THANK YOU FOR
ALLOWING ME TO SERVE.
BOB SPRINGMEYER: ALL RIGHT.
NOW I'VE GOT A GOOD SELECTION
OF QUESTIONS.
IF ANYTHING COMES UP DURING
THE PRESENTATION, IF YOU HAVE
A PERTINENT QUESTION YOU WOULD
LIKE ASKED, WE'LL COME BY AND
PICK UP THE QUESTION.
WE HAVE A COUPLE OF ITERATIONS
OF THIS DEALING WITH HEALTH
CARE.
UTAH RESIDENTS ARE GENERALLY
YOUNGER AND HEALTHIER THAN THE
REST OF THE NATION, YET WE
HAVE CHALLENGES IN HEALTH
CARE.
THE OTHER PART OF THAT
QUESTION IS HOW WOULD YOU
PROCEED WITH HEALTH CARE
REFORM.
AND I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE
SENATOR HATCH GO FIRST,
FOLLOWED BY PETE ASHDOWN.
I WANT YOU TO BE SURE YOU
DISTINGUISH YOUR POSITIONS
FROM THE OTHER CANDIDATE.
SENATOR HATCH.
ORRIN HATCH: I DO NOT BELIEVE IN
UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE "ONE
SIZE FITS ALL."
I THINK WE'VE HAD THE LOWEST
COMMON DENOMINATOR IN HEALTH
CARE.
BUT I THINK WE NEED TO COVER
THOSE WHO CANNOT AFFORD TO BE
COVERED.
I'VE BEEN RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE
OF MOST HEALTH CARE BATTLES
BACK THERE.
IN FACT, IT STARTED WITH HOME
HEALTH CARE, ORPHAN DRUG BILL,
THE CHIP BILL, RIGHT ON DOWN
THE LINE.
WE HAVE TO CONTINUE TO TRY AND
WORK TO COVER EVERYBODY, BUT
OVERALL I THINK WE NEED TO
FIND TREATMENT AND CURES, AND
I THINK THE WAY TO DO THAT
WILL BE THROUGH EMBRYONIC STEM
CELL RESEARCH.
IF WE CAN PURSUE THIS -- AND
THE UNIVERSITY OF UTAH IS ONE
OF THE LEADERS IN THE COUNTRY,
MARIO CAPECCI IS ONE OF THE
LEADING RESEARCHERS IN THE
COUNTRY.
IF WE CAN PURSUE THIS, AND
I'VE MET WITH ALL KIND OF
NOBEL LAUREATES.
THEY BELIEVE WE MIGHT BE ABLE
TO RESOLVE AN AWFUL LOT OF
ILLNESSES IN THIS COUNTRY.
BECAUSE THEY COULD BE DIVIDED
INTO 240 SOMETHING DIFFERENT
FORMS OF HUMAN TISSUE.
AND WE HAD MAJOR SUPPORT IN
THE SENATE FOR THAT.
THERE ARE A LOT OF MAJOR
THINGS.
I'M ON THE HEALTH CARE
COMMITTEE WHERE I'M CHAIRMAN.
WE HAVE MEDICARE, MEDICAID AND
ALL OF THE OTHER HEALTH CARE
MATTERS.
PETE ASHDOWN: I BELIEVE IN SIMPLICITY.
WE HAVE MEDICARE, MEDICAID.
WE NEED ONE PROGRAM TO SERVE
ALL AMERICANS AND WE CAN DO
THIS IN A SIMPLE FASHION.
MY BUSINESS HAS HAD TO BEAR
THE COST OF HEALTH CARE FOR
EMPLOYEES OVER THE PAST FEW
YEARS AND I'VE SEEN PREMIUMS
GO UP AND BENEFITS GO DOWN.
AND I THINK IT'S FAILED AND I
THINK THERE'S A LOT OF ROOM
FOR GOVERNMENT TO STEP IN
AS FAR AS HEALTH CARE.
I WANT TO SEE DOCTORS PAID FOR
WHAT IT COSTS, BUT I DON'T
WANT TO SEE THIS FIGHT GO ON
ANY LONGER THAT DRIVES UP THE
COST OF HEALTH CARE.
I DON'T WANT TO SEE CEO'S
GETTING HUNDREDS, HUNDREDS OF
MILLION DOLLAR PARACHUTES WHEN
THEY LEAVE THE COUNTRY --
EXCUSE ME, THE COMPANY.
THAT'S ATROCIOUS.
THEY'RE BENEFITTING OFF THE
BACK AND LIFE AND DEATH OF
AMERICAN PEOPLE.
WE CAN DO THIS SIMPLE.
HAVE A UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE
PROGRAM.
I'M WILLING TO PAY INTO IT AS
A BUSINESS OWNER.
WE PAY MORE IN HEALTH CARE
COSTS THAN ANY OTHER COUNTRY
IN THE WORLD.
WE NEED TO DO IT SMARTLY AND
EFFICIENTLY.
ORRIN HATCH: WE ARE DOING A LOT OF
THINGS.
MEDICARE AND MEDICAID ACCOUNT
FOR MORE THAN 70 PERCENT OF
ALL SPENDING.
I'M IN THE MIDDLE OF ALL OF
THAT BECAUSE I HAD A RANKING
POSITION AS CHAIRMAN.
BUT MOST HEALTH CARE BILLS
THAT HAVE PASSED HAVE BEEN
HATCH BILLS AND MOST OF THEM,
IF NOT ALL, I'VE BEEN ABLE TO
PASS BY WORKING IN A
BIPARTISAN WAY WITH MY FELLOW
DEMOCRATS.
IF YOU SEND ME BACK I'LL DO
WHAT I CAN TO RESOLVE THESE.
ASHDOWN: ONE SENTENCE, I THINK 30
YEARS IS ENOUGH TO RESOLVE THE
PROBLEMS WE HAVE WITH HEALTH
CARE.
SPRINGMEYER: WE HAVE QUESTIONS ON
ENERGY DEVELOPMENT.
WE HAVE OIL COMPANIES ENJOYING
RECORD BREAKING PROFITS.
DO YOU THINK IT'S TIME TO AND
THE INCENTIVES GIVEN TO THEM
AND WHAT IS NECESSARY FOR
ENERGY DEVELOPMENT?
IT'S YOURS PETE.
ASHDOWN: THE NUMBER ONE FORM OF TAX
RELIEF I CAN DO IS WORK TO
REMOVE SOME OF THOSE
INCENTIVES AND TAX BREAKS TO
COMPANIES THAT DON'T NEED
THEM.
AS A SMALL BUSINESS OWNER I
HAVE NEVER RECEIVED A TAX
BREAK FROM THE GOVERNMENT.
I HAVE ALWAYS RELIED UPON
MYSELF TO BUILD MY BUSINESS.
SO TO SAY FOR THESE COMPANIES
WITH RECORD PROFITS TO GET TAX
BREAKS, WHEN THEY CAN FIND
VENTURE CAPITAL, I THINK IS
WRONG.
THAT'S WHAT I'M SEEKING, TO
BALANCE THE EQUATION.
I'VE DRIVEN 25,000 MILES
THROUGHOUT THE STATE, AND SEEN
GREAT OPPORTUNITIES.
SENATOR HATCH HAS TALKED ABOUT
THE OIL SHALE AND TAR SANDS,
AND THERE MAY BE OPPORTUNITY
THERE.
BUT WE'VE BEEN DOWN THOSE
ROADS BEFORE.
WHAT WE HAVEN'T BEEN DOWN
BEFORE IS WHAT THE WESTERN
STATES ALL AROUND US ARE
DOING.
WYOMING; WIND POWER,
GEOTHERMAL.
CALIFORNIA; SOLAR POWER.
WE SHOULD BE ON TOP OF THAT
BECAUSE WE HAVE ALL OF THOSE
OPPORTUNITIES IN UTAH AND
THEY'RE GOING SQUANDERED
BECAUSE OUR LEADERSHIP IN
WASHINGTON HAS NO VISION
TOWARDS THE FUTURE OF ENERGY.
SPRINGMEYER: SENATOR
HATCH: I'VE ALREADY BEEN RIGHT IN
THE MIDDLE OF IT ON THE ENERGY
BILL. BECAUSE I'M ON THE
RANKING FINANCE COMMITTEE I
GET PUT ON EVERY CONFERENCE
COMMITTEE.
I WAS ON THE HIGHWAY
CONFERENCE AND ABLE TO GET
1.8 BILLION DOLLARS NEEDED FOR
UTAH ROADS, THE MOST EVER
RECEIVED.
BUT I WAS ALSO PLACED ON THE
ENERGY CONFERENCE AND I PUT
FIVE MAJOR COMPONENTS INTO THE
BILL.
TAR SANDS AND OIL SHALE.
CANADIAN OIL, 90 PERCENT COMES
FROM OIL SHALE AND TAR SANDS.
I THINK WE SHOULD GET BETTER
PERMITTING LANGUAGE TO GET TO
SOME OF THESE PROPERTIES.
WE PUT IN MEASURES FOR
GEOTHERMAL.
IT'S ESTIMATED WE COULD
PRODUCE ENERGY FOR 22 MILLION
HOMES, ALMOST THE WHOLE WEST.
AND WE HAVE INCENTIVES IN
THERE.
IN THE LAST 40 YEARS WE'VE
ONLY BUILT ONE OIL REFINERY.
PART OF THE PART IS THOSE THAT
CLAIM THEY WANT DEVELOPMENT OF
ENERGY BLOCK IT.
I PUT IN THERE THE CLEAR ACT
THAT GIVES INCENTIVES FOR
ALTERNATIVE FUELS AND
ALTERNATIVE NEWLY VEHICLES.
IT'S ONE OF THE REASONS WE'VE
HAD AN EXPLOSION IN HYBRID
CARS.
SO ALL OF THESE THINGS WE'RE
DOING, AND WE NEED TO DO A LOT
MORE, AND REPEAT SOME OF THE
THINGS PETE SAID AS WELL.
ASHDOWN: I THINK WE'RE GOING TO
NEED OIL THROUGHOUT MY
LIFETIME.
I THINK WE SHOULD BUILD OIL
REFINERIES, BUT FOR EVERY ONE
BUILT WE SHOULD PUT OUT A
SOLAR WIND MILL.
WE HAVE A GREAT
ENTREPRENEURIAL FORCE TO TAKE
ADVANTAGE OF THESE IDEAS.
I'VE TALKED TO SOME OF THE
PROFESSORS WORKING ON THESE
TECHNOLOGIES, AND THE MONEY
THEY'RE GETTING IS FROM THE
DEPARTMENT OF SECURITY, NOT
THE DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY.
THEY'RE IGNORED, AND WE DON'T
LOOK TOWARDS THE FUTURE.
HATCH: I THINK WE DO.
THE DEMOCRATS BACK THERE HAVE
STOPPED THE DEVELOPMENT.
WE WERE GOING TO GET DRILLING
DONE IN THE GULF OF MEXICO.
TO PUT IT IN REAL TERMS WE GET
1.5 MILLION BARRELS FROM SAUDI
ARABIA.
WE HAVE TO DEVELOP OUR
RESOURCES BUT ALSO BE CAREFUL
TO DEVELOP THINGS THAT ARE
ENVIRONMENTALLY SOUND.
WE'RE CONSTANTLY WORKING ON
THOSE AND HAVE MADE HEAD WAY.
SPRINGMEYER: COUPLE QUESTIONS ON IRAQ.
YESTERDAY WE PASSED A BARRIER
ON THE NUMBER OF SOLDIERS
KILLED IN A MONTH.
LOOKS LIKE 100 IRAQIS KILLED
EACH DAY.
WE'VE SEEN IT GO FROM "STAY
THE COURSE" TO NEW BENCH
MARKS.
WHAT SHOULD BE THE ONGOING
POLICY WITH REGARD TO IRAQ?
SENATOR HATCH FIRST.
HATCH: WE HAVE TO WIN THERE.
WE HAVE NOT HAD A MAJOR
TERRORIST INCIDENT SINCE 9/11.
AND THERE'S A REASON FOR IT.
THE REASON IS WE'RE TAKING IT
TO THEM IN AFGHANISTAN AND
IRAQ. AND ANYONE WHO DOESN'T
REALIZE WE HAVE A WAR AGAINST
TERRORISM ISN'T LIVING IN THE
REAL WORLD.
WE HAVE TO KEEP GOING.
THERE HAVE BEEN 16 TERRORIST
ATTEMPTS SINCE 9/11, THANKS
MOSTLY IN PART TO THE PATRIOT
ACT.
WE HAVEN'T HAD TERRORISM
BEFORE.
IT CORRECTED A LOT OF THE
DEFICIENCIES AND BROUGHT IT UP
WITH THE ANTI MAFIA LAWS AND
ANTI CHILD MOLESTATION LAWS.
WE'VE CONVICTED OVER 200
TERRORISTS, AND HAVE ABOUT 163
MORE IN THE DOCK THAT WE'RE
GOING TO PROSECUTE.
AND THE KEY IS, WE HAVE TO WIN
THAT WAR.
WE HAVE TO STICK WITH IT.
IT'S BETTER TO TAKE IT TO THEM
THAN OVER HERE.
WE LOST 3000 PEOPLE IN ONE
FAIL SWOOP.
CAN YOU IMAGE IF ONE OF THESE
TERRORIST GROUPS GETS A
NUCLEAR WEAPON AND GETS IT
INTO NEW YORK OR LOS ANGELES.
I CAN TELL YOU THERE'S A REAL
EFFORT GOING ON TO TRY AND
DESTROY OUR COUNTRY
ASHDOWN: I THINK THAT QUESTION HAS
BEEN SPLIT OFF INTO WHAT WE DO
ABOUT TERRORISM.
I WANT TO TALK ABOUT IRAQ.
I THINK IT WAS WRONG.
I DON'T THINK THERE WAS AN
IMMINENT THREAT, AND I DIDN'T
SIT ON THE JUSTICE COMMITTEE
AND DIDN'T HAVE THE
OPPORTUNITY TO ASK THE
QUESTIONS: WHY IS THERE A
CONNECTION BETWEEN SADAM AND
AL QUAIDA, WHEN HE DOESN'T
WANT EXTREMISTS IN HIS
COUNTRY?
I DID NOT HAVE THAT
OPPORTUNITY.
YET SENATOR HATCH DID.
YET WE WENT IN.
DEPOSING SADDAM WAS A GREAT
GOAL, BUT WE SHOULD HAVE DONE
IT WITH OUR ALLIES.
WHAT DO WE DO NOW WE'RE THERE
NOW.
THIS HAS RAGED FOR ABOUT A
YEAR.
ONE SIDE SAYS WE SHOULD GO,
ONE SAYS WE STAY.
I ASKED THE AMERICAN PEOPLE ON
MY WEB SITE. WHAT DO YOU
THINK WE OUGHT TO DO IN IRAQ?
AND I THINK THE SUGGESTIONS
WERE ARTFULLY BEAUTIFUL.
THE PEOPLE THAT HAVE TO DEAL
WITH THIS ON A DAILY BASIS ARE
THE IRAQI PEOPLE.
I THINK WE SHOULD ASK THE
IRAQI PEOPLE TO HAVE A
REFERENDUM.
IF THEY WANT US TO STAY, WE
SHOULD STAY.
BUT IF THEY WANT US TO LEAVE,
WE SHOULD LEAVE.
HATCH: THE FACT IS WE'RE THERE
AND THERE FOR A VERY GOOD
REASON, AND THAT IS BECAUSE WE
WANT TO KEEP TERRORISM THERE.
TERRORISM IS REAL.
WE FACE IT EVERY DAY.
I'M ON THE INTELLIGENCE
COMMITTEE, AND I CAN TELL YOU
THERE ARE PEOPLE OUT THERE,
MAINLY AL QUAIDA, BUT OTHERS
AS WELL THAT WOULD LIKE TO
DESTROY THE UNITED STATES OF
AMERICA.
AND AS LONG AS I'M THERE THAT
ISN'T GOING TO HAPPEN.
ASHDOWN: YOU GO INTO ANY COUNTRY,
LIKE YOU GO INTO IRAQ, YOU'LL
HAVE A LOT OF PEOPLE WANTING
TO DESTROY AMERICA.
WE WENT INTO AFGHANISTAN FOR A
VERY GOOD REASON.
I SUPPORTED THAT ACTION.
BUT THE IRAQ THING, IF WE GO
INTO ANY COUNTRY, IT WOULD BE
LIKE IRAQ.
TO SAY WE HAVE TO FIGHT THEM
OVER THERE RATHER THAN FIGHT
THEM HERE.
I DON'T BUY THAT.
SPRINGMEYER: NEXT QUESTION IS ON
IMMIGRATION.
THE CURRENT IMMIGRATION SYSTEM
IS BROKEN.
WHAT IS YOUR PLAN TO ENSURE WE
HAVE LEGAL IMMIGRANT WORKERS.
DEFINE YOUR POSITION
ASHDOWN: YOU'RE RIGHT THE
IMMIGRATION SYSTEM IS BROKEN.
WHEN WE HAVE PEOPLE LIKE THE
SCIENCE FORCE TODAY LEAVE THE
COUNTRY, SOMETHING IS WRONG.
WORKER AND STUDENT VISAS
ARE FAR TOO LOW.
IF I HAVE TO GO THROUGH A
BUREAUCRATIC MESS TO DO IT,
THEN I'LL PROBABLY DO THE
LATTER, COME IN ILLEGAL.
I THINK PUTTING TECHNOLOGY IN
PLACE CAN DO A LOT.
I ALSO AGREE IN SECURING THE
BORDERS.
I THINK SOME OF THE DEPARTMENT
OF DEFENSE SHOULD USE SOME OF
THAT TECHNOLOGY THEY USE ON
THE IRAQI SYRIAN BORDER AND
THE U.S. AND MEXICAN
BORDER AND THE CANADIAN
BORDERS.
OUR BORDERS TODAY ARE NO MORE
SECURE THAN THEY WERE ON 9/11.
WE NEED TO FIX THE TWO
BORDERS.
WHEN THAT'S DONE, FIX ILLEGAL
IMMIGRATION, AND FIX THE
BORDERS AND HOLD EMPLOYERS
ACCOUNTABLE FOR THE PEOPLE
THEY HIGHER.
HATCH: WE'RE A NATION OF
IMMIGRANTS BUT ALSO A NATION
OF LAWS.
AND WE HAVEN'T BEEN ENFORCING
THE LAWS WELL.
I SAID UNLESS YOU SOLVE THE
BORDER PROBLEMS FIRST YOU
WON'T SOLVE THE OVERALL
PROBLEM.
IN '86 I WAS THERE WHEN THE
SIMPSON FOLEY BILL WAS PASSED.
IT GAVE AMNESTY TO 3 MILLION
ILLEGALS.
I SAID IF WE DO THAT WE'RE
GOING TO HAVE TEN TO
20 MILLION IN THE FUTURE.
GUESS WHERE WE ARE.
IF WE HAD GRANTED AMNESTY, IT
WOULD HAVE BEEN 20 OR
30 MILLION PEOPLE.
I THINK ONCE WE GET THE BORDER
PROBLEM SOLVED, AND WE'RE
USING UNMANNED AIRCRAFT AND
SENSORS, AND INTERDICTED AT
ONE POINT 1.2 MILLION ILLEGALS
LAST YEAR.
ONCE WE DO THAT AND SET A CARD
SYSTEM SO THAT A BUSINESS
PERSON CAN TELL WHETHER OR NOT
THEY HAVE A LEGAL IMMIGRANT.
THAT WAY THEN WE CAN WORK ON
THE HARD CASES.
THERE ARE SOME, WONDERFUL
MEMBERS OF THE COMMUNITY, KIDS
ARE CITIZENS, BECAUSE THEY
WERE BORN HERE.
AND WE CAN RESOLVE THOSE BUT
FIRST RESOLVE THE BORDER
ASHDOWN: THE ONLY THING THIS
CONGRESS WAS ABLE TO DO THE
LAST YEAR WAS BUILD A FENCE.
700-MILE FENCE FOR A
20000-MILE BORDER.
AND SENATOR HATCH HAS HAD AN
OPPORTUNITY TO RESOLVE THE
PROBLEM.
IT'S TRUE HE VOTED AGAINST
AMNESTY.
BUT WHAT HAS BEEN DONE TO
RESOLVE THE ONGOING
IMMIGRATION PROBLEM.
PRESIDENT HATCH HAS TALKED
ABOUT THIS BIOMETRICS CARD.
WHAT KIND OF BIOMETRICS WOULD
YOU USE?
HATCH: I WOULD LEAVE THAT TO THE
EXPERTS.
LET ME SAY THIS, NOT ONLY HAVE
I DONE SOMETHING ABOUT THIS,
I'VE BEEN AT THE FORE FRONT OF
THIS.
WE HAVE WORKED VERY, VERY HARD
TO FIND WAYS TO SOLVE THE
PROBLEM.
IN UTAH I'M RESPONSIBLE FOR
THE NEW IMMIGRATION COURT.
I TALKED THE ADMINISTRATION
INTO PUTTING ONE OUT HERE.
WE NOW HAVE 20 BORDER CONTROL
AGENTS IN UTAH WE DIDN'T HAVE
BEFORE.
I WAS GOING TO MENTION ONE
OTHER BUT I'LL LET IT GO AT
THAT.
SPRINGMEYER: LET'S GO WITH ANOTHER
QUESTION.
A NUMBER OF NEWSPAPER
COMMENTATORS HAVE REMARKED
THAT THIS SENATE AND HOUSE ARE
THE MOST CORRUPT AND INEFFECT
IF I HAVE CONGRESS AND
SENATORS WE'VE HAD IN THE LAST
100 YEARS.
SENATOR HATCH, ARE THEY
CORRECT?
AND WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO
TO MAKE THIS GOVERNMENT LESS
CORRUPT.
HATCH: OF COURSE THEY'RE NOT
CORRECT.
I HAVE TO SAY, THE VAST
MAJORITY OF PEOPLE IN CONGRESS
ARE DENY, HARDWORKING PEOPLE.
AND OCCASIONALLY YOU HAVE
PEOPLE THAT DON'T LIVE
ACCORDING TO THE RULES.
AND FRANKLY THE CONGRESS IS
TAKING CARE OF THOSE.
THEY HAVE THEIR OWN PROCEDURES
AND OWN WAYS OF GETTING RID OF
THEM.
AND FRANKLY YOU'VE SEEN IN THE
CASE OF FOLEY, HE WAS FORCED
TO RESIGN.
NO QUESTION ABOUT IT.
THERE HAVE BEEN STAFF MEMBERS
THAT WENT OFF, AND IS NOTHING
WITH YOU A BAWLED FACE CROOK.
THERE'S NO EXCUSE FOR FOLEY,
AND THE DEMOCRAT FROM FLORIDA
THAT HAD MONEY STORED IN HIS
FREEZER.
YOU'RE GOING TO FIND PEOPLE
LIKE THAT THAT DON'T ABIDE BY
THE RULES.
BUT IT'S BEEN MY EXPERIENCE
THAT THE VAST MAJORITY OF
PEOPLE IN CONGRESS LIVE BY THE
RULES.
SOME IGNORE THEM, BUT THE FACT
OF THE MATTER IS MOST ARE
PRETTY GOOD PEOPLE.
AND THESE ARE PEOPLE I
DISAGREE WITH POLITICALLY, BUT
THEY'RE DENY PEOPLE AND
WORKING TO THE BEST OF THEIR
ABILITY.
AND I THINK THE MEDIA HAS THE
TENDENCY TO CLIMB ALL OVER
EVERYBODY BECAUSE OF THE ACT
OF THE FEW
ASHDOWN: ACCOUNTABILITY, THAT'S
WHAT WE NEED FROM THE PEOPLE
WORKING FOR US.
I WOULDN'T RUN A BUSINESS
WHERE I DIDN'T HAVE ANY IDEA
WHAT MY EMPLOYEES ARE DOING
WITH THEIR TIME.
WHY SHOULD OUR GOVERNMENT BE
ANY LESS REVEALING?
IT'S EASY.
I'VE BEEN PUBLISHING MY
CALENDAR, SCHEDULE ON LINE FOR
ANYONE TO READ.
MEETINGS WITH INDIVIDUALS ARE
ON IT AND IT'S SOMETHING I'LL
DO WHEN I'M IN OFFICE.
THAT KIND OF TRANSPARENCY CAN
BE DONE.
WE CANNOT ONLY SEE THE JOBS
THEY'RE DOING BUT HOLD THEM
ACCOUNTABLE ON BUDGETS AND
EXPENDITURES.
I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE SEEN MIKE
LEAVITT STOPPED AT TWO FLIGHTS
INSTEAD OF 20.
HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN FLYING
COACH LIKE THE REST OF US.
THAT'S SCRATCHING THE SURFACE
OF THE WASTE IN WASHINGTON.
WE NEED A CLEAR ACCOUNTING.
AND I FIND IT ATROCIOUS, THAT
THIS CONGRESS WHOSE SO INTENT
ON MONITORING THE AMERICAN
WILL EVEN TO THE ABRIDGEMENT
OF THE BILL OF RIGHTS CAN'T
MONITOR OURSELVES.
SENATOR HAS TERRITORY SAID WE
DIDN'T HAVE A METHOD TO
MONITOR THE MEMBERS OF
CONGRESS.
WELL I CAN TELL YOU, I CAN
MONITOR YOU.
HATCH: MAYBE I'LL HIGHER YOU.
I'M PROUD OF YOU, AND I HOPE
YOU KEEP DOING WELL IN YOUR
BUSINESSES AND I INTEND TO SEE
THAT YOU DO.
I RESPECT YOU, AND I THINK
SOME OF YOUR IDEAS ARE GOOD.
THERE'S NO QUESTION THAT
CONGRESS IS ACCOUNTABLE.
THERE ARE SO MANY RULES THERE
AND PEOPLE HAVE TO ABIDE BY
THEM.
WHEN THEY DON'T, WHEN YOU SEE
A DANIELLE CRANE HAVE SEX WITH
A 17 YEAR OLD PAGE, HE WAS
THROWN OUT BY REPUBLICANS.
SENATOR FOLEY, THROWN OUT BY
REPUBLICANS.
BOB -- NO, I WAS THINKING OF
SOMEBODY ELSE.
BUT MY TIME IS UP.
REPUBLICANS GET RID OF PEOPLE
WHO DON'T DO WHAT'S RIGHT.
SPRINGMEYER: TWO QUESTIONS ON GLOBAL
WARMING AND WE'LL GO TO PETE
FIRST.
THE FIRST IS JUST GLOBAL
WARNING QUESTION MARK.
A RECENT BRITISH STUDY SAID WE
COULD SPEND ONE PERCENT OF OUR
WORLDWIDE GNP OR SPEND 20 TO
25 PERCENT LATER.
ASHDOWN: I GREW UP IN UTAH AND I
REMEMBER IN BOUNTIFUL WE USE
TO HAVE 3 FEET OF SNOW FROM
NOVEMBER TO MARCH.
WE DON'T HAVE THAT ANY MORE.
THE EVIDENCE THAT GLOBAL
WARMING IS HAPPENING IS
READILY APPARENT TO MY EYES.
BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY I LOOK AT
THE FACT THAT WE CAN'T EAT THE
FISH WE CATCH IN OUR STREAM.
WE CAN'T EAT THE FOWEL WE
SHOOT FROM OUR SKIES BECAUSE
THEY HAVE MERCURY IN THEM
BECAUSE THE POLLUTION HAS
BECOME SO PERVASIVE AND
AFFECTING OUR ENVIRONMENT AND
OUR WAY OF LIFE.
I THINK THAT CLEAN ENERGY IS
POSSIBLE.
WE JUST NEED TO DO IT AND WE
CAN STOP THESE CARBON
EMISSIONS, EVEN MORE SO THAN
IN THE UK.
I BELIEVE WE CAN TURN THINGS
AROUND AND I BELIEVE WE SHOULD
AND IT'S CRITICAL TO THIS
PLANET WE DO SO.
HATCH: I HAVE NO DOUBT THAT THERE
IS GLOBAL WARMING.
BUT THE QUESTION IS, WHAT DO
YOU DO ABOUT IT?
HOW MUCH WOULD IT COST TO MAKE
A REAL DIFFERENCE OR CAN WE
CHANGE SOME OF THE WAYS WE DO
THINGS AND MAKE A BETTER
DIFFERENCE.
ONE OF THE BILLS I HELPED PUT
THROUGH, ONE OF THE MOST
IMPORTANT ENVIRONMENTAL BILLS
IN THE LAST 20 YEARS, THAT
BILL WILL DO A LOT BECAUSE IT
WILL MOVE US TOWARDS
ALTERNATIVE FUELS AND ENERGY.
LAST YEAR I DROVE A HYDROGEN
VAN.
IT WAS LIKE DRIVING THE
SWEETEST CAR ON EARTH.
THE PROBLEM IS IT COSTS ABOUT
$3.26 A GALLON FOR HYDROGEN.
WE NEED TO MOVE TOWARDS
NUCLEAR POWER AND HAVE COOKIE
CUTTER PLANS.
WE HAVE ONLY 80 MILLION TONS
OF HYDROGEN IN THIS COUNTRY.
IT'S THE CLEAN EVIDENCE POWER
THERE IS.
WE NEED TO WORK ON NUCLEAR
WASTE
THEY'RE WORKING ON IT IN
RUSSIA AND I BELIEVE WE CAN
WORK ON IT IN REAL WAYS
WITHOUT BANKRUPTING THE
COUNTRY
ASHDOWN: NUCLEAR POWER IS NOT THE
CLEANEST POWER THERE IS.
SENATOR HATCH IS FAMILIAR WITH
THE MOAB TAILINGS PILE.
THERE'S A POWER CALLED NUCLEAR
FUSION.
THERE ARE PEOPLE WORKING ON IT
AT STANFORD, AND U OF U.
AND WE FACE BUDGET CUT
CUTS.
SENATOR HATCH TALKS ABOUT HOW
EXPENSIVE IT WOULD BE TO PUT
IN PLACE TRANS CONTINENT
TESTIMONY RAILROAD.
AMERICANS CAN SOLVE THE
PROBLEMS, WE JUST NEED THE
LEADERSHIP TO PRESS FORWARD
AND DO IT.
HATCH: I DON'T HAVE ANY DIFFICULTY
DOING FAST RAIL.
I WISH WE COULD DO IT.
WHAT PETE ASHDOWN SAID IN ST.
GEORGE HE WAS GOING TO DO A
300-MILE PER HOUR FAST RAIL.
AND WE ASKED UTA AND THEY SAID
IT WOULD COST IN THE AMOUNT OF
$350 MILLION.
THAT'S TYPICAL DEMOCRAT
REASONING
ASHDOWN: I WOULD RATHER BE SPENDING
THAT MONEY ON AMERICANS THAN
HALIBURTON IN IRAQ.
SPRINGMEYER: A COUPLE QUESTIONS HERE.
SENATOR HATCH, YOU SAY YOU
WERE ONCE A LIBERAL AND NOW A
CONSERVATIVE.
